I don't think that you need to keep the franchise to neither Ripley nor the Xeno. There are different ways to expand the franchise, I wrote a topic about it titled Ideas for alien-movies, please respond to it if you want.

There could be new monsters, we've already have the Hammerpede, Xeno-fifield which wasn't really a Xeno, the Newborn even though it looked like crap. Yes the franchise could expand without the Xeno.

No, it cannot.

Ridley is wrong. It's like: "I hate X, but I have to put X in the story, so I intend to screw up X and say: «See, this doesn't work, the beast is cooked!!!»" This is a kind of sabotage, hooliganism.

And Ridley can't be right because... why? Because he's not the cornerstone of the franchise. He's just "one of". Books, toys, comics, video games, board games, etc. Everything proves that the xenomorph is more alive than all living things. We just have one person who is unhappy with X and wants to persuade others to his point of view. That's all.

For all who don't need an Alien - there is RbW. A great example of how you don't have to screw up the X franchise for your dubious ideas.

"This is a kind of sabotage, hooliganism"

I get the Impression that the Addition of the Xenomorph is NOT what Ridley Scott had wanted, it seems he was FORCED to include it.  Maybe he did go OK so i am Forced to Abort my Ideas for Prometheus 2 to give them the Xenomorph, well lets SEE what they like ONCE i make my David the Creator...... but then we cant RULE out Hill and Giler as far as Influence on the Synthetic Creator Plot.

I dont really want this to become another (WHAT REALLY) was Wrong with the Prequels Debate or a David could NOT have Created it Debate as those have been more COOKED than the Xenomorph ;)

Ridley Scott is RIGHT in My Opinion with when he had said their is ONLY so much Face Hugging, Chest Bursting and Snarling that you can do.

Also when he says that you can have the Xenomorph but you have to CHANGE IT and EVOLVE IT.

I think after ALIENS then you had to UPLIFT or EVOLVE it, we HAD to wait until Alien Resurrection before we saw some Success to a Degree of WHAT a Company could do with the Xenomorph in its Possession.

With AR then the Potential was with Ripley 8 as FAR as what can be done with the Xenomorph DNA... Regarding the Xenomorphs though, they appear to be the SAME and thats a Snarling Aggressive Species that can be USED to Eradicate a Enemy but you have a Infestation on your Hands.....

WHAT would Happen and HOW do you Re-Engineer it to Control it?  Or can you input some-kind of KILL SWITCH to it or Limited Life Span?  Then as a Bio-Weapon it makes more Sense.

OR... can the Xenomorph Evolve, either Naturally or via Experiments like we saw with the Apes in Planet of the Apes.

so you can UPLIFT the Xenomorph that way as IF you Continue with the Space Termites Formula you get Action, Death, Guns... but then you could END UP with a Starship Troopers with a ONE TRICK PONY.

I think that after ALIENS we should have looked at Evolving and Uplifting the Xenomorph, and Alien Ressurection gave us some INSIGHT into this.. but it was FLAWED, and also the Queen had become Tarnished a bit.. and the NewBorn was more a Ambomination.

AVP gave us the Xenomorph in a Movie that was Executed a bit like ALIENS, as a Non-Canon alternative Universe the PLOT was Decent... just having it on Earth in the 20th Century was a Mistake...

AVPR had turned the Xenomorph more into a JOKE

Alien Covenant had attempted to UPLIFT the Xenomorph but all it had done was to TIE the THEMES of Creation etc and ARC of wanting to be a Creator with the Xenomorph via Davids Arc, but this just Elevated David and Diminished the Xenomorph for Many...

As it NOW had became NOT really ALIEN.

I think we have to FORGET about the PAST... ignore the Origins..

We have to LOOK at what this Perfect Organism can do as far as EVOLVE or HOW it could be Engineered.. and WHAT is the Hubris of this ;)

The Xenomorph is NOT DEAD... but you have to be Careful... if its OVER DONE or done BAD then its NOT FAR from that FINAL NAIL in the Coffin...

UNTIL YEARS down the Line they REBOOT the LOT. (but will it be Different?)

Regarding RS its a SHAME as he had ideas on how to Uplift the Xenomorph before Cameron came along, it was NOT the Fault of JC though.... RS was Busy and JC had kind of Uplifted what to do with the Xenomorph, the QUEEN had made Sense, it was Equally as Iconic.

After Aliens it went WRONG... because JC had introduced the Space Termites... but this merely opened up the Potential that the Xenomorph could have been a Pres-Existing Species the Space Jockey had encountered and tried to EXPLOIT.

But it also could have been a Creation, in which we see the Organism is VERY ADAPTIVE....

What Would become of Hadleys Hope had all the Sulaco Crew been Killed?  So WHAT becomes of a HIVE in say 6 Months,  a Year, 10 Years or 100 Years...

Do the Xenomorphs just remain like Space Ants/Termites?

They are more Intelligent than Ants/Termites but what is the LIMIT to their Existence?

Or WHAT would Happen if you try to Exploit the Xenomorph and Meddle with it?  Could you TRIGGER a Unwanted Evolution of the Species?

At the Begining the Beast was more than Meets the EYE.... but a lot of what the STARBEAST was has been LOST.

Can that be Resrected and passed onto the Xenomorph?

Or maybe you can Resurrect the Starbeast Ideas in the Form of something that EVOLVES from the Xenomorph or something that Pre-existed the Xenomorph and LV-223!

For EXAMPLE..... could the ULTRAMORPH be something of a Future Evolution?  Or is this the ALPHA and the Origin to all that Happened on LV-223?

Or do we STICK with the Xenomorph? 

Then do you UPLIFT or EVOLVE it or if you think "its NOT broken then DONT Fix It" but can you Spawn out another 3-4 Movies with that Formula?

Each new film introduces the xenomorph in a different way.

OG Big Chap in Alien.

Hive warriors + Queen in Aliens.

Animal-like guardian in Alien 3.

Mixed clones-mutants + hybrid in Alien Resurrection.

Deacon + all other things in Prometheus.

Neomorph + praetomorph in Alien Covenant.

I don't understand what kind of development and evolution we are talking about? It's already here. We even gave up the facehugger, and got a trilobite + motes + predalien instead. Evolution is already here.

Perhaps you are talking about other ways of birth? If this is something new, but "usual", then... better not! Generic things don't fit the Alien Universe.

It looks like you are simply repeating Ridley's metaphysical sayings. He talks about it all the time, but the only time he tried to introduce new things (Engineers, Black Goo) - he avoided talking about them! Do we need new things to avoid exploring them? Do we need new things to try to milk the viewer over 6-10 sequels with an endless promise to explore them? Is there a convincing answer here?

I for one will keep it alive, but as I have mentioned I'm sending the critter off on a long Vacation.

I have exactly ZERO influence on the industry, and frankly that's just a-ok with me...put me in the same room with Giler and Hill the world would see me nuclear scorch-earth their egos and leave them bawling in the corner.

I've looked into their involvement with ALIEN franchise, and I really have to say they have Earned my hatred and contempt of them.

I will finish up the appearances of The Alien in my works and leave leave it alone thereafter...but it will NOT be gone.

The Audience will be privy to an in-universe secret guaranteeing it's spectre of menace shall hang over the galaxy for ages and eons to come.

Less Is More.

That said, I might reference Ripley, but she will never set an active foot in my universe. That character has had her time.
I have to admit though, it's fun to ponder how she'd react to Chimerans aboard ship...

And as we have all been saying, it's a BIG universe with so many, many other stories to tell about new encounters, new threats, new wonders.

The Xeno can continue but keeping it interesting might be the challenge. I hate to be a broken record (remember those?) but BWW's PERSPECTIVE was a unique take on actually BEING the xeno. It seems like it would be very tricky to sustain a story like that for a longer one. It would be interesting to see a short film like that. The closest I saw was The Alien Covenant VR video In Utero:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2OQ6wT0whA

dk

I can do a little more from the viewpoint of The Alien.

In the sequel, I might add some moments like that in.

In ORIGIN, you'll get a rather unique and involved viewpoint from The Alien's way of experiencing life. :)

That's all I will say, no spoilers, not with ORIGIN. :)

Blackwinter-witch Having little bursts from the xeno perspective sprinkled throughout could be interesting and possibly become just as memorable of a character as anyone else in the cast.

dk

I am keeping that approach in-mind...but will test as I go. Less-is-more after all.
But it's a valid idea and if I can make the burst-moments work properly, yes!! :D

...and The Alien should always have some secrets left unanswered. ;)

BWW: You can have it in some of your stories but I think that you're right about leaving it alone for a bit. I would rather have stories where they try something else. What you wrote about Giler and Hill might be an exaggeration but I totally understand your point. Not sure what they did to make you that disappointed but art is subjective and no one can agree with everything.

You're right about Ripley, time for something else. She did well in three movies, but they should have left her after that. We don't need a Skywalker-story in the alien-verse. The franchise has many potential directions that it can go into, there is no reason to have the same old family in everything.

I have an idea that is tied to Ripley in a way that you might agree with, let's say that there are economic interests that still want the Xeno or something else for whatever reason so there is some sort of resistance-group that is being organized against that. Those interests could be compared to Sky net and how far the reached they were, obviously this isn't about robots or terminators I just mean the range of it.

What if Ripley is referenced to as a source of inspiration? The ghost/spirit of Ripley is around even though she has passed away years ago. Both Giger and OBannon are not around, but they are still being mentioned in discussions and are important to how the franchise looks still so why can't Ripley being dealt with in the same way?

Did you watch Rogue One that's within the Star Wars-universe? You also have the Mandalorian which is a spin-off, there was also something about the Ewoks in the 1980s. Star Wars Rebels is another one that is the same kind of thing. There is a possibility to do something similar with the Alien-franchise. Some people (not personally aimed at anyone) might say that the Alien-franchise isn't suited for that but I say why not?

Leto:

Did you mean this one that you said no to?

“Can the ALIEN Franchise Survive without the Xenomorph?”

The thing is that if you show that kind of monster too much then it might get old. You can do variations of it like there are different kinds of birds but they are still birds, the same goes for the Morph. You can have Xenomorphs, Neomorphs, and so on. One of things that AC did right was to have the Neomorph so there is a possibility for new things. Maybe your complaint about getting rid of the Xeno was a misunderstanding of language at least partially even though that's understandable. Adding new monsters is something that I think that the prequels did right. I understand that some people want to see Xenos again but I'm not one of those people. Sure they can be added but they don't have to. People watch these movies for different reasons. The alien-movies need more than interesting monsters to succeed.

Scott might be half-right when he says that the Xeno is done. You don't need to show it that much (it becomes more effective that way) but it can still be there. The way that it was in AC where it was in the daylight on the crane was really bad although it was maybe alright as a piece of action although too short. If he had cared about that as much as he cared about the flute-fetischism then it could have been interesting. What I don't like is that it has turned into a story about androids without much of a balance, that's crap. Not sure if Scott alone is to blame for the focus on androids or if there are other people responsible for the mess too. Remember that Scott is just one of those that are involved although his obsession with David isn't good. He isn't without blame but there could be other people involved that affected the story too is my point.

People watch the movies for different reasons, I don't watch it for the Xenos alone but they are important parts and are well designed but I think that there is also place for something else. For example would you like to have a lot of Star Wars movies where they always have the Emperor just because he was an important part in the first two movies? Star Wars is just and example but I bet that you can take other things like The Lord of the Rings, Star Trek, whatever. I would not and I'm glad that the prequels at least tried something new even though we can discuss if they were successful or not. My opinion is that none of Prometheus or Covenant are better than a 2 out of 5 which isn't good but not a disaster either.

I looked up what the word Alien means, one of the things that it said was “coming from another world”. This fits the various alien-monsters in the franchise and also I might add the Engineers since they are not from earth too. Nowhere in the title does it say that it has got to be about the Xeno only, it just had a big role if we look at the first three movies. My reason for limiting it to the first three is that they are those that I prefer. At this time I'm honestly more interested in seeing more about the Engineers even though the morphs are interesting too.

You mentioned books and other things, yes that can be seen as a success financially but it can also be seen as a regress since the Xeno becomes all too familiar and looses its point. I can see both sides of this, there are different ways to look at it so I kind of understand where both you and BD are coming from.

Ridley isn't always right but he isn't always wrong either. He is right about the Xeno that you can have other monsters but he is dead wrong about turning it all into a story about David and androids. I don't care about Raised By Wolves, my criticism of that is similar to what I said about AC.

I dont really want this to become another (WHAT REALLY) was Wrong with the Prequels Debate or a David could NOT have Created it Debate as those have been more COOKED than the Xenomorph ;)

Thoughts_Dreams

I LIKE your idea of 'referencing' Ripley!! It honors the character, actress and the creators of the franchise...yet allows things to evolve and progress forward and in new directions!!

My reasons for loathing Hill and Giler are because they always kibbitz and screw around with the franchise, and don't know what they're doing, while simultaneously spitting on O'Bannon. They're a pair of disrespectful, fan-hating clods who should Retire...or BE Retired as they are dinosaurs who bring nothing new, good, fresh or interesting to the table.

Also, on a personal level...they're total pricks.

I will be playing 'Less Is More' with The Alien, I seek to give it back it's Mojo, it's Mystique and Enigmatic scariness. I will be very, very diamond-cutter careful with any elements of 'Alien Perspective' in my works in accordance to that.

I have a LOT of development work done regarding The Alien...where it came from, what kind of planetary biosphere could create it, how it's biology and physiology work, etc, etc. I dug deep and put in a massive amount of work to figure this critter out.

Someday I might publish all that as 'Mysteries Of The Alien'...but not anytime soon.

ORIGIN will give you and everyone else a glimpse of where it came from, and why facehuggers have the ability to secrete acid from their ovipositor to burn through a faceplate...there is an evolutionarily-adaptive reason for that, I assure you. :D

ORIGIN is a stubborn, demanding work...it accepts nothing less than my absolute best effort, and that is exhausting, so progress is made, but slowly.

....and David's knock-off-a-morph AIN'T The Alien.

Not to me, anyways.

I have a LOT of development work done regarding The Alien...where it came from, what kind of planetary biosphere could create it, how it's biology and physiology work, etc, etc. I dug deep and put in a massive amount of work to figure this critter out. 9apps cartoon hd

nathmaheshmp

I don't see anything really useful in the links, they're just general main-page types....is there a specific app you're trying to show us??

 Blackwinter-witch Looks like spam. Reported.

At dk and BWW,

OOOOOOOHHHHH FOR F! Sake did you both click on that link?

If you did there could be anything loaded on your computers now....you all know we have to be absolutely careful opening any links.....the spammmers could put ransom wear on your computer and destroy your all your files....key loggers, viruses, trojans, they could be using your computer as a proxy in a botnet, they could have turned your computer into one of the ghost army bots and more!!!! there is always more!!! and the rest of it.

Never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, pause taking a rest from typing never, NEVER, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never click on just any links in open forums........that is a lot of nevers, ;)

Even the best security software can’t protect you from the headaches you’ll encounter if you click an unsafe link. Unsafe links appear to be shortcuts to funny videos, shocking news stories, awesome deals, or “Like” buttons, but are really designed to steal your personal information or hijack your computer. Your friends can unknowingly pass on unsafe links in emails, Facebook posts, and instant messages. You’ll also encounter unsafe links in website ads and search results. Use these link-scanning tips to check suspicious links. All of these solutions are free, fast, and don’t require you to download anything.

These services can help you test a link if you are unsure but if the hackers are good enough they can fake these services out too.....

Website Reputation Checker:

This service helps you detect potentially malicious websites.

Check the online reputation/safety of a website.

https://www.urlvoid.com/

BlackAnt This looks like the most creative spam I have seen. Shall it be reported?

We actually did a parody spam thread a while back lol. It was very much the fun!

https://www.scified.com/topic/44899

BigDave, where are you? Hope you are well and return as soon as possible. 

Miss your wisdom and your posts!

Yeah, you must be extremely careful with these spammers. It would be nice to have a button for spam alert.