MEETING GOD

Well the thing is NO ONE! knows the Truth.... Its debatable about how old Bible was written and i dont want this to go into a whole Religon thing, because everyones beleafs is their own and really this is about a Movie... so dont take my point bad ;)

But there is no real 100% way to prove of God, unless he Magically apears to us all, but then without getting into a Religious Debate.... Scriptures would sugest even if that happened, it would by some be seen as False... same as if Aliens turned up and said yep we created you... again some would rub it off as False...

So again i am not going to debate on religon, what i am saying now is in ALTERNATIVE Context to the Movie...

Can we prove God? is it a question of Faith, is there more to us than just a living vessel that dies and so we are back to dust.....

Can we prove Evolution or the Big Bang?  as a poster put! "Life could of come about by some astronomicaly rare combination of elements and actions people just find it hard when they see life today"

Well from what i was told the Movies Plot is BIG and BOLD and loosely touches up and connects Religon losely but also other ancient cultures.... and that the Plot is very out there....

Basically what we could be seeing is a way to yes touch upon that there is more to it than Big Bang, Evolution etc... but some GREATER POWER... but not to be caught up in a literal Magical God of the Bible/Koran or other cultures...

But to somehow throw a sinister Curveball.... i think he wished to bridge the gap between Big Bang and Evolution and the Devind Being that is God and bring us something that in part can account for both but in a very bold way.

some of his latest comments had seemed to back up what i was told in March,  back than and after Ridley was saying no More Gods and Dragons... yet my source said this was not the case and indeed it would be very loosely Gods and Dragons and a lot had doubted that... and thought Ridley saying no more Gods and Dragons meant just that.... but his comments the last 3 months have indeed been going very much GODS AND DRAGONS...

One of his latest ones he was on about how there is more to life and all the things we have and do than just Science of it all....

"I tend to bounce from pillar to post, wondering what I'm going to paint next. But this was a call to duty, really, to reexamine and resurrect the Alien, if I could. Its role had been worn out in previous films, but one of the questions that had never been answered was why such a creature would be invented, and by whom. That opens much larger, more universal questions. I've met a lot of scientists who have whet my appetite for the technical possibilities of the future, but I've always wanted to get a group of them together and ask them if they're religious. Because you'd be surprised how many dyed-in-the-wool astrophysicists there are who say that, yes, they believe in God. And I ask them how that relates to the profession of mathematics. Science will say we are random and biological. So if you go further than that, and say you believe in a higher power, are you saying you don't adhere to the scientific plausibility of why, say, you and I can talk on this phone right now? Or is there a much larger connection that we can't grasp yet? For me, that's the biggest question we have left to explore, and that will be the underlying discussion of the next Prometheus film."

This is a very big statement.... but again dont get thinking he is going to give us something that will relate literally to the Bibles God....  i mean how does the Engineers and Xeno fit with that?  Nope he is going to ask this very big Question but throw a Curveball....   much like 2001: A Space Odyssey did but then Prometheus does has similarities with that....

The source said elements of the Plot are very Blade Runner and more so Matrix.... now i think they must mean as far as Bold Plots...

"This is a very big statement.... but again dont get thinking he is going to give us something that will relate literally to the Bibles God....  i mean how does the Engineers and Xeno fit with that?" 

gonna say it again on this. paradise lost....how was paradise lost? satan tricked adam and eve into eating the fruit from the tree of the KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL. basically, what if we were to substitute that, for the tree of MORALITY, which is what the knowledge of good and evil are. now, lets go back to what ash says about the xenomorph:

"I admire its purity. A survivor... unclouded by conscience, remorse, or delusions of morality.."

there was another thread about the xeno life cycle here..... t

he next sci fi question part relating to the bible: the black goo, whcih seems to react to the presence of sin as others have hypothesised.....what if the xenomorph is a parasite which spiritually adapts to its' host, and not physically? and what if the life process of the xenomorph is that which bridges the paraSITE into paraDISE.....

finally, and i don't know if this has been mentioned before, but has anyone else noticed that the entire environment and weather of planet LV is seemingly affected by the presence and actions of the humans in the temple/base/tomb? 

Lol Ben if the bible you read now has even 40 percent of the original one in it I'll eat my hat pretty sure your copy is not 3500 years old did you say?! http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/07/06/ancient.bible.online/ check that and that ones 400 years after Jesus and loads was supposed to be changed in the Roman times before that. You only need to use common sense to realise why would so much in these text be so much better for men hmm possibly because they were the ones in power altering it hmm just maybe lol. Ah man you need to read about evolution you seem to know nothing about that either not sure what to say sorry except it means if it didn't exist then every species on the plant just suddenly appeared from no where is that what you think? lol funny stuff.  And who said life always existed lol I said it could of come into existence through a extremely rare situation though more than likely if something made the universe they put all the parts in place so that it would happen that's if it was made of course :) . And yes let's chat about this it's part of prometheus! Maybe if we did have the original bible there wouldnt be a declining interest in religion like we have these days...I wonder...

^

1. There's only a decline in religion because of the people themselves. 

2. Torah, and Judaism is a part of the teachings of Christ. Which those two I mentioned formed Christianity.

3. Evolution has never been proven. We can compare skulls of animals and men all day long. Darwin's evolution theory, as acclaimed by many, believe that we evolved from some kind of monkey. 

4. Nothing I said was funny. If you find it funny then go ahead and laugh. 

5. Who said life always existed? Scientists and atheists. 

6. I'm not about to get into another debate with this. 

7. The men of God wrote the bible starting with Moses. Who by the way wrote down the ten commandments as spoke by God himself. 

8. I don't understand evolution because it makes "0" sense. 

can we please not turn this into a bible discussion? if you want to mention the bible fine, but please link it back to the alien/prometheus saga. and stop with the personal insults.

Well you did start what looked like a religious thread if and prometheus is heavily soaked in religious 'stuff' :p . It's just interesting seeing what done people think most of it is critical banta :) . 

1 yes because people know allot more these days they are more intelligent ehem well most...And they see things don't add up in the texts.

2 ok but check that link? Still we have the same problem where is the original texts!

3 oh man you serious :D . You can even see evolution in action watching bacteria mutate under a microscope :O they have greatly speeded up generations. 

4 is more than funny. 

5 what do you mean :O scientist do not think life existed before about 3.7 billion years ago on earth and definitely not anywhere in this universe in the big bang at millions of degrees lol. possibly the first life was 10 or so billion years ago but no one knows of course! They do not think it always existed strange idea you have there. 

6 too late ;p

7 see link again etc.

8 wow ok I believe you now lol that was the most concise argument for anything ever!

Well you did start what looked like a religious thread if and prometheus is heavily soaked in religious 'stuff' :p . It's just interesting seeing what done people think most of it is critical banta :) . 

it was religious only insofar as there's been alot of talk about how in the sequel to prometeheus, shaw would 'meet God' so i was mentioning that with regards to start an intresting discussion about how such a meeting would possibly be depicted in alien: covenant. nothing more, nothing less. i most certainly didn't want to start a debate on evolution. if you feel it's relevant to the thread and movie, then relate what you're saying back to it.

    No one knows the truth of the universe, and to assume one does is vanity in the extreme. Are there devine powers? That is a question that has plagued mankind since his inception. If we look at the human brain, it is a vast network of energy which culminates to create a living mind. If we look at the universe, it is a vast network of energy that culminates to create...what? Life. Additionally, it is not beyond the scope of possibility that the universe is a living system that "thinks" and "feels". I do not know if the gods and goddesses presented within religious teachings are accurate. However, I do know that the intellectually honest should never disregard the possibility of something's existence simply because it is not visible. I have seen how love moves others, but I can not actually see or measure it. I have seen how hatred and foolishness cause men and women alike to commit terrible acts, yet I am incapable of touching either of those things. I have seen how cyberspace - an insubstantial and completely intellectual construct made up of thousands of connected minds - moves and flows like a living thing, still I can not actually see or touch it; I can only interact with it and see its effects.

    To search for the divine is the search for what is fundamentally life - an unknown force that gives all living things breath and the ability to exist. I can not see or touch the very basic essence that allows life to exist, but I can certainly see that it exists.

Yep real..Just in case you miss understood I am not saying God doesn't exist or that the bible definitely wasn't written originally by the 'creator' and science quiet often does not say God can't be part of the equations. I am an open minded in the middle type person but the problem comes when we start talking about what we do have evidence for like evolution and the bible...mountains of evidence that all point in one direction :) . 

This is totally linked to prometheus I mean what do you think it's all about! Pretty sure we will see our creators and maybe their creators maybe all the way up to the creator of this universe. At least I'm hoping...Maybe this will point out how crazy it is thinking we are the only ones here and God made us in 7 days the devil made fossils and God can't stop him type stuff lol...

DJAMELAMEZIANE - I completely understand and respect your viewpoints. :)

"No one knows the truth of the universe, and to assume one does is vanity in the extreme"

This is exactly true.... and lets not let this lead to a who is right or wrong as far as Religon etc.... i have studied the Bible and Literally i have found so many flaws and holes that i dont discuss because those who deeply believe will get very very offended.... as far as Evolution there are holes and there are things that add up....  Truth is none of them make 100% sense... and then we have to look at every other Religon that Proceeds the newer religons and cultures and there is some very good and strong links between them all, that you can connect them and then if you throw Evolution into the mix with some other Ancient and PROVEN! Ancient Cultures as far as oldest records (that some could argue are fake.. like well lots stuff including dinosaurs)  then there is a common theme and connections...

These themes and connections that Prometheus was trying to answer... this is that its both a combination of Evolution and some Devine interaction that lead to life on Earth... a plausible case when you deeply be unbiased.

But these have no connection with the movie,  we should not look upone Ridleys ideas or a work as a Mockery of Science.. or Blasphemy Against God....   the Movie is SCI-FI.... so its not Factual and should be enjoyed..

for the record can we prove the Bible... oh yes cus its written down..... for some thats not enough...  Can we prove Big Bang and Evolution... well their is some compelling evidence that supports a lot of it.... but no one was around back at the start and so again we cant prove that.

GOD.... Magical Devine Being omnipresent yet omniscient, created the Universe from Nothing, Magically and all creation Magically... well by devine Power of the Word....( maybe as a Stroy teller can create a World, Creatures and Events via there imagination?) We cant prove this is the case... or prove that it is not.

BIG BANG...... A Explosive event that created the material to form stars, from dust and gas and chemicals and then Planets formed and then basic Life Blah Blah and a series of Natural Events and Natural Selection led to Evolution... can we prove this to be the case...?  We cant.. can we prove its not... we cant!

Ridley is going to give us something that that would fit with the both, in a curveball way.....

I hope that he is not going the route of the WORD/BEGINING is Program or some Dreams and Imagination of some body... David, Shaw or what ever but i expect a CURVEBALL and to be prepared for something very  bizare and out there....

BIGDAVE - Hear, hear! Let us avoid abashing one-another and use our minds to enjoy one-another's company and engaging conversation! We can come together as enthusiasts of Sir Scott's work regardless of our religious views! :)

Hmmm there is allot of proof for the big bang or at least one of many big bangs not sure what you have read Dave...Anyway I'm not saying the bible doesn't have parts of the original I expect it does just not much and it's probably a good book in some senses anyway maybe in some moral and life teachings. 

But in relation to prometheus I think Ridley will take a dark look on it all especially as this is a dark film series. So probably something like God is dead gone or just not interested possibly even evil or totally devoid of emotions something like that. Although with Ridley brother gone and Ridley being and older chap now there may be a glint of niceness shining through at the end I guess. I hope it touches on this probably towards the end but it would be nice fit David to tell us all about the engineers beliefs elders etc....yes prometheus is sci fi but it's not fantasy like legend. So this means it's supposed to feel real and exist in our universe our future that's what got messed up with the characters in the last one :p . This is why it all relates back to reality...

Lol it's also the 41st birthday of discovering 'Lucy' on Google right now :)

Science is always changing and Evolving as far as answers to stuff relating to Big Bang and Evolution and we cant really definitely prove or disprove it either way...  as far as Bible goes, again a lot has been changed over the hundreds of years that parts was written.....   Again can we prove its correct or incorrect there is no 100% way to completely rule every part of it out..

There seems common themes within the Bible, and other Religons and Cultures that could be more than coincidence! does this mean there is some element of Truth?  Or are they all just re-telling of a similar Tale, that changes slightly everytime its told? 

I think this was the purpose of Prometheus to look into the similarities to then bridge some kind of Gap between them and Big Bang and Evolution and then loosely fit that lot into the STORY they are trying to tell us for Prometheus...

But its  all only Sci-Fi, even though he is trying to touch up on some pretty big things and pose some serious Questions.... for those thinking we would be taken down the Path to meet God Allmighty they must be prepared for Answers that are not going to be Literal as far as the Bible/Korans God goes...  they are going for some pretty Bold and somewhat "out side of the box" ideas if you ask me... Ridley is dropping some Red Herring Clues that lead us to think oh they are going the route of showing us God, which they could be but it will be far from the God in the traditional Sense.

We need to be looking at Themes... and not to take a look at a Literal re-telling of God... as in Plural....  Ridley has touched upon a number of times themes from Paradise Lost.... also Prometheus was touching upon Ancient Greek  Mythos which if you really look into the clues in Prometheus.. some dots do add up to that...

I think what they are doing is loosely looking at Connections between Greek Mythos, and other Ancient Cultures.... then loosely connecting them with parts of the Bible but only as far as themes that Paradise Lost Poem that was inspired by the Bible goes... and so maybe not to expect a Literal Bible Twist but more like look closer at the Greek Creation Myth and Greek Gods, and Summarian and Babylonian and throw in Paradise Loss and the Book of Enoch.. find common THEMES between all of them and then re-tell that in the Story of Alien/Prometheus but in a way that is not directly too Literal.

If it's not very literal I think it will get fudged and lost although it's not had much in it yet directly relating to our history...but it is trying to be realistic and hopefully it will be more so this time round in terms of characters (the other stuff was good) . And you cant prove stuff like evolution 100 percent not sure what you mean? You cant actually prove anything 100 percent so by that theory you cant act on anything because it's not definite lol. You have to act on what's most likely and fortunately evolution and the big bang are extremely likely! There is mountains of evidence more than you could ever read about! It's not like a man down the pub told me about it is thousands of scientists testing and pushing the theory from millions of angles over almost 150 years. I don't know what it takes to make you believe something but I call that as certain as it gets!

And if your talking about a theory with almost no evidence like we could all be in the matrix...an illusion as such and all history could be made up type thing well we can't act on that because the evidence is zilch! If we proved this tmrw I would look at it and maybe believe it if enough evidence was there but that's just it we can only act on what we have! Not what we don't.

That reminds me this highlights this problem: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VmCtxFy21SY brilliant program.

No i mean that and im bieng 100% honest here, we can not Prove the Big Bang 100% its a theory... a logical one, that holds a lot of weight... but Science Evolves and Theories Change or Adapt....   but as no Human was ever present its one of those things that will remain a very plausible theory....  some do completely dismiss it...  same as the Earth is Round (i.e Flat Earthers) and there is some evidence that lends weight to Flat Earth... and every image and video of the Earth from Space could be Faked... its possible.. but its unlikely...  there are many other clues and problems that debunk a Flat Earth.....  

Same with Religon... some things that dont add up, and go against findings such as Dinosaurs etc.....

I am not saying the Big Bang is fake at all... no body knows 100% how it started and some could argue was it by devine means... which i doubt.... as no one was there at that time its one of those things....  but the findings that point to a Big Bang or similar event do have a lot of weight that supports something similar as far as expansion of the universe and how Stars and Planets are born from Dust and Gases etc..

Im pretty much on the Big Bang Fence as opposed to Magical Devine Being created it all.... but there is some coincidences between religons and other mythos and cultures... that may provide either some Element of Truth or just re-telling of a Fable that changes everytime its passed on to one culture to the next....

This is what Ridley is going for... that there has to be some connection... i.e Ancient Aliens.... and so not Gods literally but indeed some Ancient Race who are so advanced they would seem Godlike in the things they can do....  this is the other 3rd Theory or Creation.. this theory only gives us answers to creation of Life...

And not creation of Worlds, Stars and Galaxies that the other Two theories cover... (Devine Creation, Big Bang/Evolution).   So Ridley is trying to go the route of the 3rd... Ancient Aliens route while having it tie in with Religons loosely...... but then has something Big Planned for in terms of the Prometheus Franchise and HOW THE GALAXY, STARS AND PLANETS came to be....

As i have said if you Dig then you can find things that dont quite work with Evolution, but Religious people jump all over them and over exagerate these Flaws... failing to realise that the Religious books have bigger Flaws....

All in alll thats the Biggest Burning Question...... Where did we come from, why, how did it come to be and where do we go and what purpose to we have.....   these are the Questions Ridley posed when he was doing Prometheus that i feel they wanted to loosely touch upon in a sequel to Prometheus.....

No real 100% way to answer some stuff.... apart from where do we go when we die... because thats one thing we definately have to face at some point.... only when that happens there is no way you can pass on the answers you get to others lol

So yeah i did not want this to get into a Religon vs Big Bang etc debate as to who is right....  but for people to just expect Ridley to tread a boundary between the two of those....

Then again we could all be living in the Matrix.... well you could and all of this is your imagination... you are God... everything is created by you, by your thoughts......   Remember... in the begining there was the WORD!

Just head F-ing ya lol

I hope Ridley dont try and pull a Matrix trick mind... but the source did say the Plot is very Matrix as far as the Engineers and Agenda and Hierarchy above them and purpose... but they also said it relates also a lot to Sacrifce, Rebelion, Control and Punishment.

Oh right maybe I have missed some info on the matrix angle I just thought there were images linked to the matrix as in the pods humans are grown in I thought maybe engineers are grown in the same way that's all. I mean even that pod the engineer came out of at the end of prometheus looked matrix like.

And yes creationists argue there is problems with evolution but I always find their arguments to be incredibly weak at least so far and so easy to take apart. Creationists really do make me laugh. I know it's not a 100 percent theory but it's so solid. Really it's all about people thinking the bible must be exactly true which brings me back to the point that the bible must be almost nothing like the original anyway! Even if God spoke to us explaining everything at that time do you think the Neanderthal thinking of that day could comprehend what was said anyway! Something like God saying and I created the universe in seven days and the people of that time not knowing anything outside of earth interpreted it as only earth if you see what I mean. And God said the universe is 13.7 billion years old they would just look at God like erm what the...Ok let's put that down as a few thousand then as I don't understand that type of a number type stuff!

There could be an eventual truth that combines a creator and all scientific knowledge as it stands today I really expect that to happen although of course God could come and shout it in creationists face and still they wouldn't believe God!

And I think it's a great thing that scientists are finding stuff like quantum physics a world that seems to underpin the universe with a touch of chaos pointing towards the idea that possibly you can never fully work out the universe. That might be a nice thing to put into prometheus maybe that the elders or even the demi God sill couldn't work out the universe or even measure a piece of string perfectly (like in that previous link I posted). :p