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Snorkelbottoms Scientific Theory

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Gavin

MemberTrilobiteJune 12, 2012
There seem to be a lot of scientifically minded members on these forums therefore I am inviting them, and any other members that genuinely which to participate in this discussion (which will probably get heavy, forewarned is forearmed) into this thread to discuss my "Maverick" scientific theory. Rather than post the entire theory in one big long, tedious and complex post I will begin with the following points present in my theory... 1. Our solar system was NOT born by the process described in [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accretion_theory]Accretion theory[/url]. 2. Our planet, solar system, galaxy and universe are [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_the_universe]older[/url] than people think. 3. The [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang]Big Bang theory[/url] is "partially" wrong. [u]The Facts[/u] With that lot out of the way, now to parts of the actual theory itself... 1. The Earth, and all of the planets in our solar syatem are "extremely" slowly moving away from the sun. 2. All the planets in our solar system are orbiting around the sun in the same direction (revolution)... [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0d/Ecliptic_plane_3d_view.gif/220px-Ecliptic_plane_3d_view.gif[/img] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Solarsystem3DJupiter.gif/220px-Solarsystem3DJupiter.gif[/img] 3. Which is also the same direction they are all (except Uranus and Venus) and the sun spinning on their own axis (rotation). These 3 points are observable/proven FACTS, that disprove Accretion theory and through logic, deduction, reason and common sense open up an unexpected can of worms. But before disclosing it to you, lets see if you can see what I see from these 3 observable/proven FACTS. [u]Part One - The Small Picture[/u] The Accretion Theory, in summary has two major flaws... 1. The composition of the outer planets Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus and Neptune 2. The existence of only two "belts" - the asteroid belt and the kuiper belt. If, according to Accretion theory our solar system was born from a cloud of dust, which through the process of accretion resulted in the 8 planets then how can the 4 outer planets be entirely composed of gas. And in relation to point 2, wouldn't there be more belts of debris left over from this process. Logically it just doesn't sit right. I've teased you this point with observable and known facts (see above), and some of you may or may not have deduced were this initial part is heading. So rather than continuing to tease you I will reveal the first part of the theory... ...all the planets in our solar system were born from the sun... [b]Stage 1[/b] Billions of years ago our Sun ejected, or rather vomited, a small amount of its molten surface. Because of the Sun's rotation (and revolution - more of that in part two), gravity and the force of which "glob" was ejected it was held in orbit (revolution) around the Sun. The shape of this "Glob" became spherical beacuse of the aforementioned forces acting upon it, and because of the vast coldness of space the outer layer hardened into a crust. Being so close to the Sun, and because of its molten core, this small "glob's" crust would frequently crack emitting gases which would then be held within what is known as an exosphere. Yes, you guessed it... Mercury is stage 1 It should be obvious now where this is heading for those of you that follow this thread so I'll summarise... [b]Stage 2-4[/b] As the stage 1 planet drifts further away from the Sun, it swells emitting more gases, that accumulate into an atmosphere, which helps "normalize" the temperature of the planets surface. This is stage 2 - Venus. As the surface becomes hospitable and with the production of an ozone layer and liquid water, the planet becomes habitable. This is stage 3 - Earth. With the gradual build of carbon dioxide and the gradual deteriation of the ozone layer liquid water is evaporated and/or frozen beneath the planets surface, which itself becomes barren and lifeless. This is stage 4 - Mars. [b]Stage 5[/b] No planet in our solar system is stage 5. Why? because stage 5 is more of an event than an actual stage... With a barren, lifeless and volcanic and tectonicially dormant surface a stage 4 planet is dangerous. Underneath Mars' crust it is just like that of Earth - molten, hot and violent. But because the surface of Mars is dormant this heat and energy has no means to escape. Using the analogy of a balloon, Earth is like a balloon filled with many needle holes - with the right amount of air used to constantly fill the balloon it would retain its inflated shape, but Mars is a balloon with on holes, no means of escape - blow too much air into a balloon, what happens? That is stage 5. [b]Stage 6[/b] Stage 6 covers all 4 of the outer planets (Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus and Neptune). Because of event "stage 5" all that would remain held by the planets gravity would be its atmosphere. In the explosion the crust and molten core would have been ejected forcefully out into space (asteroid belt, Kuiper belt), possibly impacting other worlds (extinction events) and/or getting caught in a planets gravitational hold (moons, rings). The planets atmosphere however, having less mass would not be able to maintain the velocity required to escape the planets gravitational hold, and ultimately would not be able to escape. But the force of the stage 5 explosion would result in the atmosphere reaching farther out than when the planet was solid. Over the course of the planets existence as a stage 6, this atmosphere would be gradually pulled in toward the planets core, essentially causing them to slowly shrink before leading finally to the next stage. [b]Stage 7[/b] Most stage 7's exist within the Kuiper belt. Put simply they are are stage 6's that have continued to shrink, to the point where their gaseous atmospheres became condensed into a liquid surface, and then condensed further into a spherical piece of rock.

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Gavin
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@ iapetus... Lol, it comes across that way doesn't it. And I admit, when writing fiction, I do believe that the audience should be teased, confused, and (partially) manipulated by the writer - it makes the journey more fun for the audience I feel. But in this case, rather than write an overwhelming OP stating every little detail, which most wouldn't read unless interested, I find it better, more social, and more constructive to discuss each element of the topic piece by piece. That way most people will be able to follow what is being said and proposed. Also, seems interesting to "think" you know where this is going, I hope you do iapetus, the more questions you and others ask down the line will help those curious but less knowledgeable about these things, to follow the theory... and its ramifications.

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David 1
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Since the Sun is not a Solid Body but a liquid fire sort of thing, it wobbles. That wobbling + it's gravity + all the Explosions that go inside and on it's surfface + all the energy it releasses and the distortion of space-time it produces makes the planets react to it [thus the spiral effect in Earth rotation]. Still not getting the Venus thing and Uranus thing.
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
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iapetus
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David 1 again pointing finger at Uranus, Snorkel...
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Gavin
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@ David 1... Your right about the Sun's wobble, but all the planets wobble too, because of shifts in their own gravity, and reactions within their molten cores (for the inner planets). That point is another, non-coincidental similarity between the Sun and the planets, but we'll come to that later. And for now just ignore Venus and Uranus, we'll also come back to them later. Again I'll ask these two questions, they mean seem trivial and nonsensical, but their importance is in the obviousness... Q - If the Earth and all the planets are very, very slowly moving away from the Sun.. 1. Where will they be in 10 years time - further or closer to the Sun? 2. Where were they 10 years ago - further or closer to the Sun?

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Batchpool
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Q1. further from the sun Q2. closer to the sun That's my answer anyway.

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Gavin
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Exactly Batchpool, now here's one for the maths heads... The Earth is moving away from the sun at a rate of 15cm a year, and is approximately 150 million km from the sun (rounded off). How many years would it take (minus the effects of gravity and revolution - to simplify things at this point) for an object emitted from the sun, moving away from the sun at the rate of 15cm a year to travel 150 million km?

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Batchpool
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Let’s see if I’ve got this right. 100,000 cm = 1km, To travel 1km at 15cm per year takes 6667 years To travel 150 km takes 1,000,050 years To travel 150,000,000 km takes 1,000,050,000,000 years. Roughly.

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iapetus
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yup, if we go with 150*10^6km and 15cm... converting both in meters goes: 150,000,000,000m / 0.15m/yr=1,000,000,000,000yr So... if I keep trying to divine where you're headed, are you implying that Earth (and other planets...?) was/were formed by outgrowths pearling off and away from the sun? and which accordingly would make Earth 1Tera-yr old? Cause, I got a small but tough gravel I might place in your shoe... Interesting stuff, but watch for your soles, me say! ; )
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Spartacus
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Thanks iapetus I love Snorkys Threads and have been monitoring this to try to learn something and other than yourself no one else followed Snorkys suggestion and posted supporting Pics as you did, and I just love the pics, they are like "Cowbell" to me, and help so much to understand the science here...[b]"I GOT TO HAVE MORE COWBELL" !!![/b] [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0uvVZg4Tw4]MoreCowBell[/url]
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Gavin
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Well that figure isn't exactly right, because of the following reasons... 1. The closer Earth would be to the Sun the shorter its revolution would be. 2. The closer Earth would be to the Sun the effects of the Sun's gravity and "push" would be greater. 3. The younger the Sun is, its gravity and "push" would be greater. 1Gy, isn't exactly correct, it depends upon the standard used - some refer to a billion as being 1000 million, others to 1 million million - using the first standard the number would be 150 billion (second standard would be 150 thousand million), but as shown in points 1 and 2 that number isn't accurate. The actual number would be significant smaller... which could be approximated if we knew at what rate the other planets were moving away from the sun, and the rate of which the sun is losing its gravity. @iapetus, you are getting ahead of yourself, but lets save that hypothetical piece of gravel till we come to it... @ Sparky, glad you're keeping an eye on this thread. Contributions by all are welcome, as long as we all try to keep on topic (so as not to confuse those following the theory).

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Batchpool
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If the earth is travelling a greater distance every year to go round the sun, that would suggest that the velocity of the earth is increasing. That being the velocity of the orbit round the sun, and not the axis upon which the earth turns. I think I need to be careful not to expand any further on this answer just yet.

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NoXWord
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Just a quick update. I haven't been very active lately, but I am keeping an eye on this thread every now and again. Still curious about your ideas.
Ridley Scott will eventually tell us how the Queen was born. Right now we have the Deacon; coming soon the Mercury, the May and the Taylor.
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Gavin
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Well I think before I continue iapetus should reveal his piece of gravel.

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David 1
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I wonder if this thread goes well with Beethovens 7th... [img]http://www.lesvanites.fr/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/zardoz+head.jpg[/img]
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
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iapetus
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nah, you can carry on. My piece of gravel was pretty much made of what you then took out of your hat. That is, the fact the gravity effect couldn't be considered to have acted constantly in an equal way or that Earth's speed of distancing must have been decreasing through time and hence 1Tera-yr was exaggerate. A couple other 'minor' (erm) considerations but relatively similar so I guess you took them into account but it's hard to tell as keep us steering in the dark. Will tell in due time if it seems needed. For now, I'm still following your lead but also trying to get what you were meaning with the 'various deifinitions of billion'? Was it between english and other languages? You UK/US barbarians clearly need some sweet French influence and learn that metric/decimal system we invented ; ) Just to make things clear, to me (and in English equivalence to the Systeme International): 10^3 = kilo = thousand = 1000 10^6 = Mega = million = 1,000,000 10^9 = Giga = billion = 1,000,000,000 1^12 = Tera = trillion = 1,000,000,000,000 Can't believe how you guys (reverse-brained-anglo-saxon) again managed to mess with something we built so well... oh well...
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iapetus
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@David 1 Am glad am not the only one posting non-sense here and there on this thread, was getting worried Snorkel would start taking the piss against me. Keep on going, I will find something for next time he posts! we're gonna melt the dude down! bwahaha!!
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Lone
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WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSSHHHHHH! That's the sound of all this going straight over my head! Now I'm not an idiot....hmm.....hang on....... maybe I AM? I have an artistic brain not a mathematical one.......just give us the short version Snorky. PLEASSSEEEEEEEEEEE

THE LONE GUNWOMAN

"Let The Cosmic Incubation Begin" ~ H.R. Giger

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David 1
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Math has always been a problem to me because I don't understand the language in it self. I look at an equation and I can't tell what the equation is talking about. Wich in it self is odd since I have a Philosophical background. I should be more carring about math and I'm not [I guess there are a whole lot of philosophical schools dealing with cosmology, Ethics, Metaphysics and whatnot that I'm more inclined to, but funny enough the math ones never gave me a boner]. So here's my interpretation of the dilema: The Earth moves away from the Sun but eventualy the Sun will expand and swallow the 4 inner planets before becoming a White Dwarf. Hence we can say that the Earth is get away and getting close at the same time [although that is a semantics fallacy] But please do explain me what about Uranus and Venus. If Venus is tilted in it's poles that could mean that something on the planet or outside the planet made it tilt [i.e. a gravity shift/pull from inside the planet or outside the planet] As for Uranus I can only speculate that it's counter-rotation is due to the same principle: something inside the planet or outside the planet made it cournter-rotate. GOD I WISH I COULD UNDERSTAND MATHEMATICS LANGUAGE
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]
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xenodochy
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@Snorkelbottom Do you want us to bear in mind which website this is and not get stoned like Cronos?
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Gavin
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All will start to become clear later on guys when I unveil part 1 of the theory. @ xenodochy, I am sharing this theory here amongst friends and those interested in the questions of the universe.

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